Progress/Status of 64 Studio 3.0 release

why wasting you time with 64studio-3 it's in the end of nearly 3 year old cycle of canonical LTS support. Right now the 64studio development team are building a new distro based on Debian Squeeze. Meanwhile i will suggest you "Tangostudio" it's based on Ubuntu-10.04-LTS and it's very 64studio-like OS. it has Gnome desktop environment, it's pulseaudio free and even has include the 64studio default wallpaper (so you don't feel nostalgic :D ) But perhaps if you want to be on the cutting-edge. Than i recommend you to try KXStudio cheers Biser

updates to your personal repos would be a cool thing. posting your views on the development...also cool. But what we learn from all this is that we are not as tight of a community as one hopes we'd be. we "tinker" on our pc's everyday and still feel stuck in another time frame or year because while there are raves about this new apps or this software's ability to perform better than it did back when, leaves you feeling left out of the community loop. Not just this community but the whole linux community. Even under 3.0 beta, i was never able to run FL Studio because of the way it behaved with the kernel and the age of the packages vs. the age of the patches applied. (and LMMS is not FL Studio and has a very LONG way to go) WineASIO never behaved right in a Hardy environment. Trying the "other" distro with a updated kernel proved good....While i find that FL Studio runs better WITHOUT a realtime kernel...it still works flawlessly. Something i could not achieve in 64 Studio. Perhaps a new look at 3.0 (hopefully with a jaunty or even karmic interior) would pull me back to try this out. till then i make music and enjoy the system i have built, waiting hopefully that 64 Studio will put to rest the views spreading around the web that it's a distro soon to die.

I am currently in Germany, and is not able to check on my 64 Studio life daily as some of you are able to, it seems. Believe it or not, I am also a community member, and is only included in the team because I was (and is) so impressed with the reliability and performance of my 64 Studio system that I wanted to give back. Unfortunately I now see that this is not common. If you want change, help bring it about. THIS is what I am trying to say with each of my posts in this thread. I will be back in my studio by January, and will then be able to start tinkering with my systems again. Until then, I am stranded. Daniel is working on the core at the moment, now that his book is completed. Know that I, as a daily user of 64 Studio will not allow it to become hopelessly out-dated, and will start posting some un-official updates to packages on my personal repository if needed. I hope this clears up any misunderstandings. You are free to choose any operating system you want to use. It is called freedom. If you want the choice to be 64 Studio, and you have the know-how to help in any way, join the developers list, and write me a mail.

Hey Mick... Sorry about the typo. I meant lurch. Which, in itself is not a bad thing. I am sorry that it caused offence. Cheers, and make some music. It will make us all feel a bit better.

Hi there, a harsh discussion is going on here, but lets calm down everybody. But It could be nice, if somebody could give us some information about the future of 64studio. Is the release of 3.0 off the board and you jump directly to 4.0 based on ubuntu 10.04, or will there no future release of 64studio and this is the end like it happened with JAD. The Developers were to busy so they stop JAD. Is the same happening here (it would be a great lost)??? I looked up the Roadmap, but no change since one year, still just 34% finished. So please will give someone the community and the users some Information. It would be very nice and we appreciate it. Greeting Thomas

...it seems that no one is arguing about the quality of 64studio or *the need to improve communication.* how? what is the role of the core developers and what is the role of the community? what models have worked well with other FOSS projects to keep the community updated and engaged (participating) during long development cycles?

All of us at one time were not Linux savvy. However, it does...not maybe, but does come in time. As afar as tweaking the dickies out of your system each time you reload is rather meaningless. BUT you do remember and do become comfortable with the certain little things... each time ones reloads there is that list of "to do first"... For contributing to this distro..i have...THAT'S why i feel let down and ignored by those developing. STILL NO ANSWER! Hopefully others will catch on and try alternatives. Because frankly the alternatives are just as good (if not better than because of the community support) than 64 Studio. I still have 64 on the drive,....sitting there cold and unused. I have found my new install of Ubuntu to be excellent and every much a competitor to this distro. Yeah yeah you got some tweakin to do with Ubuntu..especially if you go straight Ubuntu and then JUST ADD the RT kernel...but hey...happy, modern, updated, AND a hell of a support community. IF 64 studio version 3.0 is anything like what Transmission is......well I won't hold my breath

Trouble is, I'm between the devil and the deep blue sea. The only distro I have had any real success with is 64studio; so if development were to ever stop, I'd be shtuck. It's the only distro I have tried where I install it, and its ready to go (apart from the acpi thang, but we got over that quite easily). I get really frustrated when i have to do loads of tweeking and googling, because all I want to do is make music. I spose if you are really Linux savvy, doing all those twiddly bits is fun and a challenge, but 64studio just seems to have done all of that for me. So for me I'm hoping and praying that everything goes well for Quentin and the boys, so 64studio does have a long and fruitful life. mick.ca, I've read most of the forums and see that you are a valuable contributor. so I hope you will "hang on in there" and that stuff will start to happen the way you would like it Rob (shakky)

I removed a obviously offensive post above. Having said that..Quentin's "leaching" statement was inappropriate and frankly rude considering the man doesn't know me. secondly, i whole-heartedly agree with ethanay; the lack of updates, lack of communication, lack of community...there are 50times better response in "other" forums. 64 studio is a great distro...never denied that. but the lack of (all the above mentioned) is why people are "leaching" away. we are tired of waiting...When the author can write a blog but can't update the flock...he will be spoken badly of. (but then again when you have corporate on your side who needs the the community and users.) AND after all this uproar about progress...NO ONE HAS YET TO POST A THREAD WITH AN UPDATE ON THE PROGRESS...DO YOU SEE NOW **ROB** WHY SOME ARE SO OFFENSIVE...they are not listening to you...or me...or the community. we have been asking for a progress report since JULY!!!! they aren't listening. If we get an update it will be because i spoke up and said something OFFENSIVE!!!!

for me the issue was never the quality -- it was the complete lack of communication, a forum that needs upgrading (e.g., to be able to track threads!), etc that left me "tuned out."

I have been using 64Studio since March and I love it. No other distro has enhanced my music production like this one. I have tried pretty much all of them, and none of them work as well as 64studio (Beta or not). Everything just works and works well. I too have been a little frustrated, even to the pint of giving Ubuntu studio a second chance. That lasted for about 3 hours. I just got so fed up with the snail pace and hanging around, 64 studio went back on. Free, Quentin, you may not throw out endless updates and fixes, but when you do give us something, it is the best; and I want you to know there are many of out here who appreciate every thing you do. Yup, I'm looking forward to the next release, but to be honest,I don't know how you can improve on the beta, for me anyway, it has evrything I need( I've even got used to the acpi thang!). this beta has enabled me to arrange and orchestrate around 20 songs, so I have no complaints Can't understand why some people have to be so offensive, you certainly don't deserve it. Lokk for to all that you have planned guys Thank you again Rob (aka shakky)

EDIT: ***This earlier post removed by user***

Daniel is now actively working on the 3.0 release. Unfortunately no ETA yet %-| 64 Studio had a similar community, but as people like mick.ca leached away, the core became a lot thinner. This could change in future when the power gets put back in the hands of the open source community. Do keep checking back here. I am currently on an extended business trip and can only occasionally check in to comment or help. To the die hard 64 Studio users (like myself): don't fret. Development is not dead. 64 Studio 3.0 and ultimately 4.0 will be the same quality dead stable studio distribution 2.1 was till now. Cheers from middle Frankonia

There are a ton of great things about this distro. i really hope that somewhere in the future there will be a more predictable release cycle. i can empathize with everyones frustration. WHEN is this version 3.0 going to be released!! I frankly got tired of the lack of communication and bailed. i do wish them luck. it's a stable and solid release but When it's released is no ones idea. it feels like betraying and old friend but hey...i guess old friends don't let you down either. Since i made the jump to ubuntu 9.10, ive had numerous inputs into the forums there, helping out people..feels good to have a group of people sharing knowledge and getting the job done with the support and input of the WHOLE community

...that i still really appreciate 64studio and want to continue to use/support it if i can. but maybe the distro's future is in niche functionality with embedded applications or projects like the following "DIY dedicated Pianoteq box" that is the "poor man's Muse Receptor" http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/viewtopic.php?id=667

ethanay, good news! glad that worked out for ya'. By the way i made a great advancement also. I have owned FL Studio since version 5. i purchased it when i was dual booting windows. I've had free lifetime updates and since moving to Linux i haven't used it. Never could get it to work properly. Still got my upgrades but never used it UNTIL this week!! i have FL Studio 9 XXL edition running in realtime with WINEASio layer on Ubuntu 9.10!!! ALL plugins and synth softwares working good. Only when i get 20-25+ tracks flowing simultaneously with effects, does my CPU have peaking problems. Working on that. But this is something i was never able to do until now.

thank you all for such a thought-provoking discussion...it made me wonder about my current setup, so i started exploring. after a bit of tweaking, i have Pianoteq running in real-time very nicely with ALSA or JACK on my Ubuntu 9.10 laptop with plain (non-RT) kernel. This includes access to my external firewire audio device(!), with low latencies. It was amazingly easy to set up compared to past failures... Pianoteq is performing better than ever (performance index jumped from 14 previously to 18-19 now), and that is with a network connection, bittorrent client, and firefox (several windows) running! so i am going to continue to explore whether i need to go through the rt headache...if i truly need real-time stability (e.g., for pop-free recording), i may just be able to complete the tweaking by installing rtirq and booting with the linux-rt kernel as necessary... this is closer to my dream of a simple setup (no dual boot!) that does everything i need it to without having any major interruptions in work flow.

yeah you are right 10.04 is right around the corner. I had sat here since the beginning of 2.0/2.1 and it's been almost a year since alpha for 3.0 came out. Free gave it to the community last December. So that means that 2.0 is well over a couple of years old. That is too long between versions! Too long between releases. Everyone seems to be waiting for 3.0 like it's going to be the next bread and butter distro. I have given up on progress of this distro. a Multimedia distro is clearly a lot of work for just two guys to take care of. Daniel writes books, columns in Linux Format magazine. Free is busy with contracts. Yet other distros share the load with hundred or even thousands of community members and progression happens. Ubuntu, Musix, Fedora, Artistx, hell even Puppy Linux have announcements saying when the next release to targeted for. 64 studio is like using Windows 2000, yeah you can get something done on it and it's a damn stable OS but you can't load anything new app wise because it's sorta come to the end of its life cycle. But in all defense, I have offered new artwork, a new GDM theme for 64 studio. no response. but then again this was 8-9 months ago. there was no light at the end of the tunnel then (nor is there now). The community can't help if they are not asked to. we haven't been asked so time to move on and join another movement that happily accepts help from anyone. I'm telling you, i'm up and stable, making music just the way i did with 64 studio...but with Ubuntu 9.10 (not ubuntu studio) just Ubuntu with a community realtime kernel. STABLE and brand new! I have to say i enjoy the piano roll in Ardour 3.0. been waiting a LONG time to be able to load Ardour 3.0 on my system. Ardour 3.0 rocks!!

Waiting for 3.0 was not the sole main issue, it was the absolute lack of communication as to the direction of the distro which disturbed me and led me to believe that the distro is a one man show. My past experience with solid and innovative one man distro's, is that they do not last - check distrowatch discontinued distros or this recent article "What Happens When a Linux Distribution Goes Extinct?" http://www.daniweb.com/news/story238151.html. I know it is a lot of work to support and maintain, and doing what you have to do making a living is more important, if you are not making money from it. But, this put us the community and i the user of said distro in a tight spot, similar to when using a proprietary application that you liked has been discontinued. On my main studio rig, dual Xeon, i switched to Ubuntu Studio 9.04 with the AV Linux 2.0 rt kernel. On my Thinkpad T30 i was swapping hard disk between AV Linux 2.0 for hydrogen drum programming, and 64 studio 2.1 for mastering and xvidcap screen capturing. But, beside the other issues around lack of software updates, the gnome terminal in 64 studio 2.1 started acting real weird, so i replaced it with Ubuntu Studio 9.10 which seems pretty stable thus far for day to day use. Only thing is, i am unable to get the same smooth performance from XVidcap on AV linux 2.0, Ubuntu Studio 9.04 on a dual Xeon system, Ubuntu Studio 9.10 on my T30, and Lenny on my P4 workstation as it worked on 64 studio for some reason. So i am hoping when and if 64 Studio 3.0 is released XVidcap would work as it did before on 2.1. My only concern is that, 3.0 is based on Ubuntu 8.04 LTS but 10.04 LTS will be out soon. Anyway all the best and keep up the GOOS work. BigUp, PEACE n All the Best with 3.0 HeTeP jawara

Hi Daniel, thank you for the update -- and congratulations on the fruits of your labors with the book! i completely understand about being busy with other projects. aside from that, i am reading two different communications issues here: 1) the 64 studio developers have just been really busy with other projects, so progress and communication on 64studio has stalled for a bit 2) the 64 studio communications technology/software could be enhanced to help a. 64studio developers stay in touch and b. engage community members with development on some level (beginning/advanced testers, packaging, etc) does this seem accurate?

64studio is the way to go for me. I've spent the past two-and-a-half years plodding along with 2.1 and generally I am very happy with it. I'm not about to set the musical world on fire but I do have a certain Y factor/chromosome that means I will stick with it once I've learned how to get it going. I've even installed LiveS but it's very slow on my hardware. -------------------------------------------------- BSP: http://www.mp3unsigned.com/Showband.asp?id=837 as explained in the 'Your projects' corner.

Hi all, Please accept my apologies for the lack of communication. Since the release of 3.0 beta3 earlier in this year, Free has been working on a contract which doesn't leave any time for working on distro packages, and I've been writing the 64 Studio book for Apress (now called Crafting Digital Media, out next month). Now the book is finished I'll have time to reorganise the development of 3.0. The community aspect of 64 Studio is its strongest feature, but I've found it's not all that easy to engage the community directly in development. Part of the reason for that is that our specialist tools (PDK, Backporter) were not very well documented or understood. Also, Debian multimedia packaging is hard to get involved with if you aren't an official Debian Developer. But I'm working on solutions to these problems. Cheers! Daniel

Hi Quentin, that is disturbing that even you feel a bit out of the loop. i agree that community should start picking up some of the slack, but need to be informed of developers' (ir)regular progress and the OS status. community cannot participate in a project they know nothing about! is it possible to ask someone to create a 64studio development blog or something that can help the community understand what is happening with the OS and how they can participate? it could be more tightly integrated with trac.64studio.com to "ease" people into participating. i think your feeling "excluded" is a warning sign that more communication and coordination is certainly needed. ethan ps by "disturbing" i don't mean to disparage the commercial team -- but only that the community element of 64studio is in danger. on that note, i also think the forums need a serious upgrade -- is there no possible way for me to subscribe and track replies to forum posts??

I am currently in the same position. As a community member of the team, I feel a bit excluded at the moment, as the commercial team works away to get transmission sorted. I believe that we ( the original 64 Studio users ) should start working on maintaining this wing of business by ourselves, giving back to the mother company, but using the resources to get 64studio on the bleeding edge again. I do not think that forking is a good idea, as a lot of the stability that is associated with 64 Studio might get lost if you attempt to wing it. My 2c

the lack of updates, and general "hello to the community" types of input is kinda alarming. Has anyone here looked at the new vanilla kernel with RT and run it under Ubuntu 9.04/9.10? Or even used 64 studio's kernel on a newer ubuntu? 8.04 is kinda old now in terms of features, apps and ability to upgrade other "non-music" apps. I do agree...we are all getting very anxious and somewhat impatient.

but the lack of any news/announcements is what makes me most uncomfortable -- is there any progress to report? Ubuntu 8.04 is going to be replaced by 10.04 in a couple months. I don't care much myself -- 8.04 will work plenty fine for my purposes there is nothing to "tide me over" though -- i need FFADO functionality in order to resume my music productivity. jackd/FFADO was broken on my last system, and i really just need to install a system that works from the start without needing to jury rig hardware support. i know i will finally have that with 64studio 3.0...and am very excited!

Guys! Developing a OS like 64 studio AND releasing it in a stable condition is work! I used to bitch and complain about the lag myself. (til i tried simple development projects of my own) NO EASY. playing a D chord left handed and upside down is easier! I have the lastest ardour, Jack, abiword, synths, even the latest gimp...go out and look up on Ubuntu forums the RIGHT WAY to upgrade components. (not the whole burrito) just the pieces. look up on "that" software site the way to update safely. this has "tied me over" till the guys finish the task. Yes it's been almost a year since the alpha for 3.0 came out. yes there has been TONS of changes in the linux world...but be patient. good things come to those who wait. (and it will)

Are we ever going to get the new release, I am using the beta and it works great, but I have been on the edge of my chair since April. Its killing me!

Here, here. GAIM barely works, and I've had to resort to the Windows version of LMMS in order to apply LADSPA effects like reverb to my tracks. Don't even get me started on Flash and the age of IceWeasel. Any and all info would be greatly appreciated! This post has been closed-captioned for the thinking-impaired.

i would also like to know -- is there a development blog or something that i can check regularly for updates on the progress of 64studio 3.0? i can't wait for it to come out!! it will have all the essentials i need out of the box without having to tweak it to death (like i did w/2.1). i understand it takes time to develop, but having some place i can check regularly for development updates would be immensely helpful, at least on a psychological level :)

well, for me the 3.0 beta is allready working MUCH better than Ustudio 8.4 and JAD wich i tried before